CNLP 335: Scott Beck and David Kinnaman Take You Under the Hood on How Better Data Leads to Better Decisions, Crisis Leadership, and What Will Help You Emerge Stronger Into the New Normal

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Scott Beck was the first franchise owner of Blockbuster video, scaling that company to 5,000 stores before moving on. He’s also scaled Boston Market, Einsten Bros. Bagels and Ancestry.com, among others. More recently, he founded a new company called Gloo to help churches use data to do more effective ministry.

Scott joins David Kinnaman, President of Barna Group, to talk about how local pastors can use data to make better leadership decisions. Plus, they share how they’ve led through past crises, how each company has pivoted in light of the current crisis, and what they think the new normal will look like.

Welcome to Episode 335 of the podcastListen and access the show notes below or search for the Carey Nieuwhof Leadership Podcast on Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts and listen for free.

Plus, in this episode’s What I’m Thinking About segment, Carey gives his latest thoughts on the COVID-19 crisis and how to respond as leaders.

Barna on Instagram | Barna on Facebook | Barna on Twitter
Barna’s Website | Gloo’s Website | ChurchPulse Weekly

Ministry Boost

My friends over at Ministry Boost specialize in coaching and training family ministry leaders, and they’ve just released an exciting new resource for new family retention. It’s called The New Family Retention Plan, and you can grab the turnkey solution for just $25 and start working on your plan now.

Ministry Boost understands COVID-19 has changed everything, so they’re offering a free resource just for listeners of this podcast that will help you better engage and connect families during this season. It’s got some practical ideas on how your church can navigate our current reality with an eye toward the new normal after COVID-19.

Check out The New Family Retention Plan at
MinistryBoost.org/Carey

ChurchPulse Weekly Tool Kit

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Text CRISIS to 33777 to get access to Carey’s How to Lead Through Crisis online course

CNLP 288: David Kinnaman Busts Cultural Myths Too Many Leaders Still Believe, and Shares Surprisingly Good News About the Faith of Some Millennials and Gen Z

CNLP 082: David Kinnaman on How Christians are Increasingly Perceived by the Unchurched as Irrelevant and Extreme

CNLP 125: David Kinnaman on the Clergy Crisis and the State of Pastors Today

CNLP 024: Churchless: Why and How America is Learning to Live Without the Church—An Interview with David Kinnaman

CNLP 155: Matt Engel on the Rise of Big Data and How to Use it to Pastor Your Church and Reach Your Community

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3 INSIGHTS FROM SCOTT AND DAVID

1.  Data-informed leaders become better leaders

As a leader, you trust your instincts. And trusting your instincts works out well for a while until things change, or you end up being wrong about something. Your lack of knowledge can become a roadblock if you never find out the truth. The problem is that, as leaders, we are hesitant to trust other people’s opinion and knowledge base over our own.

So, what will cause us to willingly change our mind? David has found that solid data is one of the most efficient ways for a leader to undergo a needed paradigm shift. That’s why he and his company have done everything they can to collect, analyze, and publicize critical data about the next generation in the Church.

2. Churches that thrive in Digital Babylon need to embrace technology

For years, David has been talking about this idea that we are all now living in “Digital Babylon.” He popularized this idea with his most recent book, Faith For Exiles. In the book, he outlines that we are no longer living in the Jerusalem-like culture or Christendom that used to exist in America. We are now all occupants of this foreign land called Digital Babylon.

Society in Digital Babylon has very little trust in the Church or interest in Jesus, and if the Church wants to continue to reach lost people in this new medium, we are going to have to change in some major ways. We need to understand how Digital Babylon works in order to reach people in it. We will also need to begin to use “big data” to meet the specific needs of specific people.

3. When crisis hits, look for ways to help people

David, Scott and Carey all made extremely fast pivots when the crisis hit, and those pivots are paying off. How did they know what pivot to make? Well, over the last four decades, Scott has led through many crises. From those experiences, he’s learned that you never waste a crisis. Whenever something shakes the world up, there is a way to better help people. The minute this crisis hit, he began to look for ways to help.

David has spent the last couple of years facing a personal crisis in his wife, Jill’s, battle with cancer. Through that process, he’s learned that it’s important to identify what you’ve lost in a crisis but to look for what’s been gained, as well. When the Coronavirus took over, he was looking for the positives in the sea of negative information.

Quotes from Episode 335

With every crisis comes peril, but there also comes great opportunity. - Scott Beck Click To Tweet People don't gain out of consumption, they gain out of contribution. - Scott Beck Click To Tweet In crisis, you're reminded you really don't control that much except for yourself, your posture, and your commitments. @davidkinnaman Click To Tweet It's our job to wrestle with, 'How do we bring technology into alignment with God's purposes to be able to accelerate the work that we're trying to do?' - Scott Beck Click To Tweet You can't have a good relationship with somebody if you don't really know them. @davidkinnaman Click To Tweet You absolutely can't get up every morning now as a leader without being a data-informed leader. @davidkinnaman Click To Tweet Relationship is the key catalyst in any kind of personal growth journey. - Scott Beck Click To Tweet As a leader, you need to be able to make decisions with limited amounts of information. - Scott Beck Click To Tweet Church leaders just don't seem to understand that you can't just minister to people an hour-and-a-half every couple of weeks. @davidkinnaman Click To Tweet Some of us are horse-and-buggy makers in the age of the automobile. @cnieuwhof Click To Tweet

Read or Download the Transcript for Episode 335

Looking for a key quote? More of a reader?

Read or download a free PDF transcript of this episode here.

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Select episodes of this podcast are now on YouTube. Our new YouTube Channel gives you a chance to watch some episodes, not just listen. We’ll add select episodes to YouTube as time goes on.

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NEXT EPISODE:  MICHAEL TODD

In 2015, Mike Todd took over as a 20-something pastor of a church of 200. Five years later, he has almost a million followers on Instagram, his sermons are watched a quarter million times a week and Transformation Church just moved into a 4,000 seat arena at its new building, and is debt free after 7 months in their new location. Mike explains the meteoric rise, what it’s doing to his soul, how he’s navigating it, and the power of being 51% sure a decision is the right decision. Plus, we talk about his new book, Relationship Goals.

Subscribe for free now so you won’t miss Episode 336.

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Carey Nieuwhof
Carey Nieuwhof

Carey Nieuwhof is a best-selling leadership author, speaker, podcaster, former attorney, and church planter. He hosts one of today’s most influential leadership podcasts, and his online content is accessed by leaders over 1.5 million times a month. He speaks to leaders around the world about leadership, change, and personal growth.