Intro Voice: You are listening to the regular version of Sexy Marriage Radio smr.fm. You've turned on Sexy Marriage Radio, where the best sex happens in the marriage bed. Here's your host, Dr. Corey Allan

Corey Allan: This only seems appropriate to start it this way. "OMG, you've done it again. I just finished listening to 502, and I will want to hear it again. My goodness, it's so full of great stuff. I wasn't even halfway through, and I hit pause to share this episode with my husband, my two grown sons, and our youngest's girlfriend. I'm putting myself in a precarious position in doing so, but I so wish that I would've had this information when I was younger. And my 90 year-old self would not be happy if I didn't share this treasure. What they do with it is on them, but I will continue to share until I can't. Thank you guys."

Pam Allan: Yeah, that's perfect. No regrets, right? We don't want to get to the end of life and say, "I wish I would have shared XYZ with whoever." Right?

Corey Allan: And then let's even steer it towards the relationship. "I wish I would have brought up XYZ or attempted or said or..."

Pam Allan: Whatever the topic is, yeah.

Corey Allan: Absolutely, because marriage is where we can't hide. And in family, we can't hide, no matter how much we like to think we can. We can't hide. And we're so glad that you chose not to hide with us because this is Sexy Marriage Radio, where we want to go where you want to go. And the way you can do so is let us know. (214)-702-9565 is our voicemail line. You can call there and get to the front of the line, or you can email us at feedback@sexymarriageradio.com. And if you like what we've got going on, we ask you to rate and review it. By the way, episodes are now back on YouTube. We've got the audio going [crosstalk 00:01:59].

Pam Allan: No video.

Corey Allan: ... onto YouTube video.

Pam Allan: No video, just audio.

Corey Allan: No video, but the audio shows are now happening back onto YouTube. So if that's a place you frequent or you want to have stuff in the background, you're welcome to join us there. But if you like what we got going on, please comment and review.

Pam Allan: So I'm curious, how does that work extended versus...

Corey Allan: It's just the regular versions.

Pam Allan: It's just the regular versions, okay.

Corey Allan: Yeah. Speaking of, coming up on today's regular free version of Sexy Marriage Radio is several of your questions and our answers. We're going to attempt to go through more than we've tried before.

Pam Allan: All I'm hearing is Star Trek, "To go where no..."

Corey Allan: "Where no man has gone before."

Pam Allan: Thank you. I can't even spit it out.

Corey Allan: Well, sometimes sexual encounters are that way too. I'm attempting to go where no man has gone before. And on the extended version of Sexy Marriage Radio, which is deeper, longer, and there are no ads, you can subscribe at smr.fm/smracademy. We're going to maybe, just maybe, wrap up this intimacy conversations that we've been having of the new definition of intimacy, and coming at it from a slightly different way was part two. And now we want to start spinning it towards some actionable... a framework of now what do I do with this? How do I approach this all the more? All that's coming up on today's show.

Guest Question: Hey, thanks. I did have a couple of questions. First one is what if your wife doesn't like your personality? How do you look through that? It's been a sore subject. Another question I have is how do you determine if you're a sex addict verse a high drive? I've been told that because I listened to your show and other shows, that makes me a sex addict. And then the third question is just with COVID, a bunch of people I know who've done Pure Desire or the Conquer Series, Christian perspective of how to deal with pornography have gone through relapse. And then with the stress of COVID, I was just kind of curious if you've heard of that or more couples are struggling with that because that also looks like divorces are going up on the rise too. So just a couple of different questions. Thanks for all you're doing. Always enjoy the show. Take care.

Corey Allan: So let's just take them in order.

Pam Allan: Okay.

Corey Allan: What do you do when your spouse does not like your personality?

Pam Allan: You're asking me?

Corey Allan: Well, that was kind of who I was looking at while we were talking, but I'll answer it.

Pam Allan: Yeah. I mean, I'm going to defer to you and chime in where I can, but what would you say would be the answer on that one?

Corey Allan: Well, okay, so there's two things, and I'm going to put the two together, high desire or addiction and personality. They are different contexts and subject matters, obviously, but the fundamentals are the same. If I don't like your personality, and I can use that as a broad brush statement, and I don't have to give what's the technicalities, what's the nuance, what's the specifics within that, that's what I got to know.

Pam Allan: So was that an out? Is that a way for someone to just say...

Corey Allan: Well-

Pam Allan: For them to have connected in the first place, there had to be something in the personality that she liked.

Corey Allan: Exactly. There was something.

Pam Allan: So what turned? Granted, we all... We say that you know you're really into marriage when you wake up one morning and say, "Who is this in bed next to me?"

Corey Allan: Right.

Pam Allan: Right? We've said that a few times before. So we realize that once you get into a relationship, you see all these things you didn't see before. But there's got to be something there.

Corey Allan: Yeah, you get behind the curtain and you see things. That's what we've been doing in the last two weeks of extended content, is when more stuff is revealed. But I'm also adding in the second question he had on that, because he made the comment of I've been told that because I listen to these things, I'm a sex addict. That's a broad brush stroke of just saying, you've got a problem because you're interested in this content, in this aspect, just like, "I don't like you because of your personality." Okay. That's not specific enough. And so if I hear from anybody, or if you ever told me, "You know what, honey, I don't like your personality." I'd say, "Okay, I need some specifics."

Pam Allan: Yeah, what is it you don't like?

Corey Allan: Give me some detail.

Pam Allan: Right. Do you not like the way I eat an apple? Is it that I smack my food? Or is it-

Corey Allan: Right. Maybe I laugh loud, and it's inappropriate or...

Pam Allan: Or am I just mean?

Corey Allan: Or I got all kinds of noises and smells emanating from my body. And I didn't know inaudible

Pam Allan: ... I'm always sarcastic, and I don't like someone who's sarcastic.

Corey Allan: Right. So you need some specifics, and then when you start getting that, then you can talk about, okay, wait, what's really changed and what's really that about? What's the meaning of it?

Pam Allan: Okay.

Corey Allan: Same context with high desire or addiction because those two suckers can get easily labeled... Higher desire can easily be labeled as an addict by the lower desire.

Pam Allan: Sure.

Corey Allan: Right? And so addiction, I personally and professionally do not like the whole concept of addiction when it comes to, especially sex addiction. Yes, it can happen because the chemicals in your brain, when you're talking about the fire off with orgasm, that is an addictive component that can happen. And it can be a tie to other things.

Pam Allan: You're not saying there aren't things that are addictive.

Corey Allan: Totally, I'm not saying that.

Pam Allan: Are you saying that there are way too many times that people throw around the word addiction when that's not what it is.

Corey Allan: Right.

Pam Allan: Okay, that's your concern there.

Corey Allan: Yeah so what I want to know is, okay, what are the behaviors that are manifesting because of this, that are the fallout of the higher desire or addiction? Because if it is an addiction, then you have some self-destructive things going on. Forget the consequences, forget the collateral damage, you're still going to great links to satisfy whatever. And that can cause all kinds of damage and struggle. But if it's just higher desire because you're interested in this more, Sexy Marriage Radio wouldn't be around if we didn't have higher desires.

Pam Allan: Right. Yeah.

Corey Allan: Right?

Pam Allan: Well, I'm thinking of the comparison here, for someone who wants to get their finances in order and might be the higher desire in that. Are they an addict because they listen to Dave Ramsey. Right? Am I an addict because I'm educating myself?

Corey Allan: So at the risk of throwing you completely under the bus, babe, I think you might be addicted to Excel spreadsheets.

Pam Allan: Well, I love listening to Dave Ramsey, I'm just saying, so maybe I'm an addict. But I'm just saying that just because someone has a higher desire for anything, if you're educating yourself more, that does not define...

Corey Allan: Right. So if you're going to use that kind of terminology, if you as the person themself determine, you know what, maybe I am addicted to this, now, all of a sudden you're in the process of being able to confront it better because first you have to recognize you have a problem.

Pam Allan: Well, and-

Corey Allan: But I'm hearing this as it was labeled by somebody else.

Pam Allan: Right. We're just hearing his question, right?

Corey Allan: Right.

Pam Allan: And so it is valid that anytime I'm in a situation with a spouse and they bring something up and say something, for me, I would want to at least analyze it and say, okay, is any of this reality? I need to take a hard core look at myself.

Corey Allan: What percentage of this is true?

Pam Allan: What percentage is true? What's not? And when I'm comfortable with where I am, yes or no, then I need to take it from there.

Corey Allan: I like that. Okay. And then speaking of addiction and where that can easily steer, is the whole world of pornography, which was this third point, of have I heard or come across with COVID and those people that are on the journey like myself of it's been a part of their life, does it still... is it still a part of their life? Have they relapsed? Are there still struggles? Well, what I do know is some of the latest statistics that have come out is the pornography industry has boomed with COVID.

Pam Allan: Yeah.

Corey Allan: That there... Last I saw it was up by 75%.

Pam Allan: Like sales-

Corey Allan: Just volume.

Pam Allan: ... or clicks or whatever.

Corey Allan: Yeah, volume. Traffic and sales. All across the board, is the data I saw. So is it causing more of an issue with people? Yes. Is that what's directly resulting in more marriages dissolving in divorce? That probably is a correlation and a factor, but it's not going to be linear in my mind because even just the fact that I've been holed up with somebody that I'm just recognizing more and more, I don't get along with, I don't really like, and so there's this element of nah, I'm out. And that's the final straw because before pandemic, I was able to keep myself distracted enough from you, possibly. And so there wasn't that much of an issue, and it could be level enough that it works so well.

Pam Allan: Well, I think all these things that he's saying kind of point to what that statistic is. All of a sudden, I just don't-

Corey Allan: It just gets magnified.

Pam Allan: I just don't like your personality.

Corey Allan: Good point. Good point. Yeah, it's just magnified what's already in existence.

Pam Allan: Right.

Corey Allan: And sometimes it's just recognizing, okay, so what do I need to do in this current situation to confront my role? What's my responsibility? And what, like you just pointed out the middle conversation we just had, what percentage of what they're saying about me is true? Because there probably is. Maybe it's 3%. Maybe it's only 1%, but there's still some truth in there maybe.

Pam Allan: Maybe it's 90%, I don't know.

Corey Allan: If I can have some courage to examine that, I'm in a better place and they maybe then that turns my marriage into a better place.

Pam Allan: It makes me better, I know that.

Corey Allan: An email from the inbox, Pam. "So my husband and I have been married for two years now. We're both happy with our sex life." I love newlyweds relatively into marriage and the sex world joining us at the SMR nation. "Your show has helped so much, so thank you. We were both virgins on our wedding night. I feel interested in trying new things sexually, but I'm not sure where to start. I've never watched pornography, don't even really watch sex scenes in movies. My husband watched pornography as a teen, but was miraculously set free from that addiction when he became a Christian, which was super cool. But obviously he doesn't want to talk about or plan our sex life around pornography. I hear vague allusions to things that people may try, challenging themselves, et cetera, but I feel a bit in the dark. My husband is very easily pleased and willing to try the other things, but he isn't overflowing with fantasies or other ideas either. Can you suggest some things to try to mix things up or a resource we could use to find ideas beyond simple things like changing locations. Thank you so much."
So there's a couple that come right off the bat to me on this one. One, if you want to get on the internet, there is a website out there called christianfamily... christianfriendlysexpositions.com. And if that's not exactly it, just put that in Google and it'll come right up. And these are all just drawings of like you would see the bathroom signs, the outline of the body. So you can tell it's a male or a female. So it's not anything that's provocative other than the fact that it's suggestive because it's showing... It has 230 different positions...

Pam Allan: That's amazing.

Corey Allan: ... that it shows and you could try, keeping in mind... This is one of the statistics I've kind of landed on that I think rings true. We'll see 230 different options and ways we could go about doing this thing and not all of them are just intercourse because it's also including oral. There's a variety of context of sex and our sexuality. But keep in mind that maybe about 30% of what you try, you're actually going to be successful at. Because some of the stuff's like ah, we just can't do that. My body doesn't bend that way.

Pam Allan: Just didn't do it for me, maybe.

Corey Allan: Yeah. Or sometimes we're just not capable of, especially those of us that are old like me because you not... are not old, but I am. And so I'll throw a hip out if I try some of those suckers. So that's one, it's just christianfriendlysexpositions, is a great resource.

Pam Allan: Okay.

Corey Allan: Another is an old friend of ours, Intimately Us app. He's got a great games and some things that are going that we helped create and were part of. And then he's just kind of... He's on his own with this now and doing some fantastic stuff with it. But that's safe. A game you and I have really loved is a Private Affair, but sadly, trying to find that deck of cards, because it's a print and shipped to you, they're out of inventory and they have not done another run. So it's a collector's item.

Pam Allan: Right.

Corey Allan: But we're trying to work out a way to get that out there again behind the scenes, just because it's such a great way to frame conversations and spark some dialogue. Because just as a little caveat to the people that are two years into this thing, there's only so many things bodies can do, right? There's only so many orifices that we have and appendages that we have in ways that we can touch or be touched or whatever, right?

Pam Allan: Okay.

Corey Allan: But there is limitless ways that you can experience this act with your spouse, with your presence. And if you think beyond the realms of what do we do and get into, how am I in this? Who am I in this? Who am I with in this? This is where married sex as a long game becomes really good because then you start to realize... I mean, we're 27 and a half years into this thing, coming up on 28 this year, and in some ways we haven't scratched the surface.

Pam Allan: Yeah, I would agree with that.

Corey Allan: Because we are becoming who we're becoming as this journey is unfolding, too. And so there's newness all the way through. And so yes, it's fun to find ways to spice it up, change it up, and have some fun with this. Absolutely. Add some variety and some novelty. That's a great thing. But don't discount the fact of who's doing this?

Pam Allan: Yeah. Well, I think the beauty in the things you brought up here is some... One of them is talking about positions. The app has you name it, little games and novelty and things like that. The things like... And we... You know what, we may even have an extra box with some extra cards of the Private Affair that I will mail this lady if she will send us her address because I think we have some extra cards. I'll send her some samples of it because that to me was a fun... That got my mind in it.

Corey Allan: There you go.

Pam Allan: It was not just about the body. That was more about-

Corey Allan: I love where you're going with this, [inaudible 00:17:22].

Pam Allan: ... the mind and intriguing and getting my mind past where I was before. There are things that I will happily talk about with you now that before, actually that game got me past it. Right? And of course the show I'm sure helps with a lot of people. I think it's a little different for me being your wife and listening to you talk about it, right?

Corey Allan: A little bit.

Pam Allan: But you've helped me a ton on that too. But the mind, the mind over matter, right? I love some of the things like we've done with our bedroom. Like LED lights on the headboard, that's kind of behind and gives this glow in the room and setting the ambience in the room. That can add a lot of spice as well. Maybe your only wardrobe is some long necklaces, some different things like that.

Corey Allan: Right. Have fun with it.

Pam Allan: Different things like that, spice it up. crosstalk So some fun things like that to spice it up.

Corey Allan: And the other thing to do, if you want to spice it up, come to the Sexy Marriage Radio getaway in June.

Pam Allan: Yeah.

Corey Allan: Come join us June 17th through the 20th, registration's going on right now. Come join us, and you'll hear a lot and get to experience a lot in the sense of what you'll be exposed to and how I'll challenge you in the way I'm thinking this is going to unfold. Maybe that can help add a little bit of a spice to it too. But I don't think we need to give you a ton of resources because there's some that can really get you off on the right direction. So go have fun. Send us an email feedback@sexymarriageradio.com if this was your email. I'll also try to email you behind the scenes too, just get your address and we'll send you some cards.
So another email, Pam. Says, "Hey, Dr. Corey, I was excited to find your podcast. It's refreshing to hear honesty when it comes to the Christian marriage bed. My husband and I have been married for almost 27 years.: Congratulations. "Mainly their good years," which I love the honesty of that statement. "We have good conversations about sex and usually a pretty steamy sex life. Here's my issue. Recently, my husband has introduced a couple of sex toys, which has been fun, but he seems to be relying on those instead of putting any effort into helping me achieve an orgasm. Also, during sex, he's become quite selfish, expecting me to do more of the quote/unquote work. When he's done, I can take care of myself, quote/unquote. Please don't think that I keep a scorecard of who does what. I certainly don't, but oral sex can go both ways. When I bring this up, he's quick to apologize, but the actions don't seem to change. Do you have any advice for me? Thanks so much for your time and your podcast."

Pam Allan: Okay. Well, that's interesting because toys are another way to spice it up for the last caller, but...

Corey Allan: They are.

Pam Allan: But they-

Corey Allan: Because it can make the route and the goal more reliable and easy, which is what she's describing.

Pam Allan: Exactly.

Corey Allan: This is the way, Dr. Laurie Mintz puts it clitorises and vibrations go well together.

Pam Allan: Yes.

Corey Allan: So I love this question though because it does become... I think it falls on everybody's shoulders to recognize what am I seeking with this experience?

Pam Allan: Right.

Corey Allan: What am I... So maybe because what she's tried to do is... The way I'm hearing her email, tell me if I'm wrong with this one, Pam, but she's tried... She's recognizing the problem, and she's jumping to possible solutions that aren't in her circle. She brings it up to him of what I need you to be doing. And what's disappointing crosstalk

Pam Allan: Not in her sight... Not in her circle because she can't control it. Is that what you're saying?

Corey Allan: Right. Because he apologizes. He recognizes it too, but then there's no follow-up with it. Or he quickly follows... The follow-through stops.

Pam Allan: Right.

Corey Allan: So maybe the conversation needs to start to shift towards, okay, what's our goal? Is it really just to achieve orgasm each time? I go, you go, that's it? Because maybe she's not on board with that goal and he is, and that needs to be aired. That's what's present then, right?

Pam Allan: Sure.

Corey Allan: That's the dynamic that's getting in the way.

Pam Allan: Right.

Corey Allan: But then there's also an element of, when you're recognizing this can go both ways, and I feel like he's taking the easy way out or leaving it more to me in a device rather than his involvement, have you tried communicating it's not just the goal I'm after, it's the experience with you? It's the connection with you I want.

Pam Allan: Well, that's her goal. It's not just the orgasm I'm after. inaudible

Corey Allan: That's what you're hearing? Okay.

Pam Allan: Right. You said it's not the goal I'm after. Well, what is her goal? If his is orgasm, if hers is connection, then one of them's not achieving.

Corey Allan: Once at the expense of the other, most likely.

Pam Allan: Yeah. And if I'm only doing one or the other, then you're just creating a bigger divide, and it makes sex a divisive thing in your marriage rather than something that is going to bring you together.

Corey Allan: Right. And so the thoughts would be, you've had the conversation about it, and I'd love a few more details about what was communicated and how it was specifically talked about. Because sometimes there's this element of, I say it, but it's a little lacking in a weight of how I'm saying it even, right? It's like a poor me. And I'm not saying that that's what's going on, but we can do this.

Pam Allan: Yeah.

Corey Allan: Right?

Pam Allan: Definitely.

Corey Allan: We can pitch our little fits, right? We're all capable of it. The worst in us is always capable of this. So how do you figure out what you're trying to communicate has the weight behind you to be able to say, "Look, the next time this happens and you're done and then it's the time that I get to... you get to focus... and we focus on me, no electronic allowed. This is just you buddy. That's what I want." And you just see.

Pam Allan: Right.

Corey Allan: Because that might mean that ends the encounter for a little while. And that might end multiple encounters for a little while. Because if he's like, "I'm not really on board," now you have more data to really address, okay... The way she titled her email was "Lazy Lover." But then that changes the connotation to selfish lover. He just wants what he wants, and he's not giving and he's not gracious. That's a different connotation.

Pam Allan: Totally.

Corey Allan: And so now all of a sudden, I see everything that we face in life, and this is where we're heading in the extended content to a degree too today, everything we face that's marital with intimacy and depth and connection involved, really the only thing I can do is clarify what is my next best step. And then I have to see what happens from that to then take my next one. We often think I can one fell swoop, I've said it so you should do it, right? I've told you this as an issue, so why aren't you still doing it? And then we start to shift into this well, I'm focusing on what's missing rather than what's present. And what's present in that regard is he doesn't care about your orgasm anymore. So how do you face that? That's the better question.

Pam Allan: Yeah. And you got to be willing to follow through on if you're not... Well, okay. Well, I'm trying to remember your phraseology when you're talking about it, but this... Whatever you bring to the table may mean that you don't have it for a while.

Corey Allan: Right? Well, because that's... I hear what you're saying because this is where my mind went too. It's almost being willing, as the wife, to be able to say, "Look, thank you for the introduction of a quicker and easy, more reliable way for me to achieve an orgasm. I still want you to be a part of this. In fact, I would prefer you being part of this. And if you're not willing, then I don't even need you because I've got this. And so I won't even be around for you, possibly, either. So you're on your own too, buddy." And it's just kind of a... It's calling out what's going on of, "Thank you for showing me this new avenue, but it's at the expense of us and I don't want that." And so then you have to be willing to follow through with that of, okay, so if that means he's quick to recognize it but not follow through, then you need more data to be able to call that out. And usually that's by your moves too. Well, we did at, babe. Actually made it through a lot of questions.

Pam Allan: We did. A lot of data.

Corey Allan: That was. And it is fun because I think some of the times where we've gone throughout the history of SMR, we go deep on some of the different questions, add in some different content or concepts, try to see. And then sometimes maybe we just need to answer the questions and don't need all the fluff and theory.

Pam Allan: I don't think it's fluff, but...

Corey Allan: I was trying to be self-deprecating there.

Pam Allan: Okay, well, don't do that.

Corey Allan: Okay. Well, this has been Sexy Marriage Radio. If we've left something undone or you wanted more fluff and theory and data, let us know. We can easily pick this back up and continue the conversation. (214)-702-9565 or feedback@sexymarriageradio.com. So wherever you are, whatever you've been doing, we thank you each and every week that you spend a little bit of time with us. See you next time.